The Taurus Judge is, but it has been by far the most successful pistol of its kind. Despite being a heavy, bulky weapon that holds a mere 5 rounds, the Judge can be found in most well-stocked gun stores, and its suitability for personal protection has become a hotly debated topic on internet forums. The signature capability of the.410 revolving handgun is its ability to use shot-filled shells, in marketing speak these guns are “pistols that fire shotgun rounds”. However, these sorts of bylines, while technically accurate, don’t accurately reflect the actual capabilities of the Judge or similar models of revolving handgun.

I plan to cover handgun terminal effectiveness in a later post, but to start, a brief primer on both handgun and shotgun terminal effectiveness. Note that the following is highly generalized, there are exceptions, but I’m ignoring them for now. Handguns fire single projectiles which may tumble or deform on impact. They cause damage through the direct crushing of tissue from the projectile itself. The shape and design of the projectile is as important, if not more important, than its caliber. A wadcutter.38 projectile, for example, with its flat, cylindrical shape, may cut tissue more cleanly and do more damage than a round-nosed FMJ.45 ACP projectile, despite being smaller caliber. The ultimate expression of this factor is modern JHP ammunition, which starts as a projectile shaped well for feeding in modern automatic handguns, but then expands to provide a flat, wide surface for the maximum tissue crushing effect.

Shotguns, on the other hand, shoot either a collection of round metallic projectiles, or a single short cylindrical slug. The slugs we’ll set aside for now, as they work similarly to very large pistol projectiles.

Shot, the common term for a collection of round projectiles fired from a shotgun, is packed into a shotshell atop a wad. Larger shotshells like 12 gauge can shoot larger payloads of shot than smaller shotshells, like the.410 bore. This payload can vary from the same number of much larger projectiles, or many, many more projectiles of the same size. For defensive purposes, fewer projectiles of as large a size as is feasible is preferred versus a greater number of smaller projectiles, due to the need for adequate sectional density to penetrate a target.

Smith serial numbers, as they are related to year of manufacture, are confusing. SERIAL NUMBER DATA BEFORE 1890 ARE NOT AVAILABLE. During the period of 1890 to 1916, many numbers are not sequential with blocks of overlapping numbers assigned to different types of shotguns, such as hammerless ejector.

This brings us to sectional density. Commonly abbreviated “SD”, this is an extremely important factor to understand when discussing small arms projectiles, and it is essentially the measure of the mass of the projectile per square inch of frontal area.

They’d better if they want to hit it. Then again, my gut tells me that the majority of snakes that get shot didn’t need to be. The number of non-venomous, beneficial snakes are far higher than those of venomous snakes, and they all tend to avoid humans. And again, the poisonous snakes in the U.S.

Tend to be thick, muscular reptiles, the coral snake being an exception, that probably need something more than a sprinkling of number 9 or 13 shot to stop them if they really want a piece of you. None of this applies in Australia, where apparently even the platypuses are poisonous and everything wants to kill you. I’ve run across more poisonous snakes kept as exotic pets while serving search warrants than I have in the woods or desert. I also have a personal rule that states that I will not put a hand anywhere that I haven’t visually inspected, which applies to so many aspects of life. First of all, 4.35″ 000 buck pellets have a combined frontal area comparable to that of a.7″ expanded bullet, your claim of it being comparable to a.54″ expanded bullet is leaving more than one whole 000 buck pellet out of the equation. Second of all, having the damage spread out across about 2.25″ at 7 yards (from the Shooting the Bull video) drastically increases the chance of hitting something that will stop the fight even quicker, such as the spine.

Also, a 12 gauge 9 pellet 00 buckshot has a combined frontal area comparable to a 1″ expanded bullet, but I don’t think anyone would accept a single projectile that expands to 1″ over 9 separate wound tracts over a larger area. Zx, you’re right, I gooned up the math somewhere. Here’s what it should look like (I used 0.34 for the diameter of a 000 pellet originally, so I’m using that here, too. They’re nominally supposed to be 0.36, but I’ve seen various diameters and weights in practice): 0.34 in / 2 = 0.17 (0.17 in)^2 = 0.0289 in^2 Pi * 0.0289 in^2 = 0.091 in^2 0.091 in^2 * 4 = 0.363 in^2 0.363 in^2 / Pi = 0.116 in^2 Sqrt(0.116 in^2) = 0.34 in 0.34 in * 2 = 0.68″ Having multiple projectiles does increase your chance of hitting something vital, sure, but that’s not worth giving up penetration. The penetration of a single 000 buck pellet probably won’t be that great; the sectional density and velocity from the Judge (only about 800-850 ft/s) are both pretty poor. I’ve seen some tests that showed them having adequate penetration, and some not.

I’ve never seen an FBI-spec gel test of the stuff. Isn’t the purpose of the buckshot more meant to provide a cone of fire for your 1st shot so that you get something into the target, which might cause an attacker to stop or flinch and miss you, rather than missing altogether?

Yes its ideal if you can hit them and take them down on the first shot but an actual attack in real life is likely to be a surprise and many people’s aim isn’t that good when drawing their weapon in a hurry while stressed. I don’t own a Judge nor do I think they’re a good carry piece (too large and heavy) but they always seemed a interesting option as a home defense weapon.

Its easier to lock one in a drawer by a nightstand due to the size vs. A common 18″ non-SBS shotgun. And being a pistol its easier to carry and aim one with a single hand when opening doors, holding a flashlight, or whatever. You’ve just proven that birdshot from a 2.5″ barreled revolver is inadequate for defense against humans. And exactly who believed otherwise? I’m seeing an awful amount of labor expended to prove the obvious. And did Federal even market that.410 birdshot load for defense against humans?

Or is it intended as a snake load? I don’t know about Judge ballistics, but from my own casual research it seems BB shot is quite lethal to a range exceeding 5 yards, #4 buckshot to a range exceeding 20 yards, 00 buckshot to a range exceeding 50 yards, and 000 buckshot to a range exceeding 100 yards, regardless of the gauge of the shotgun. Interesting link, valuable information. But pardon my confusion. Was this intended to answer my question about buckshot flattening in ballistic gelatin? In addition, all the tests from the link are from 3 inch barreled revolvers, none from shotguns.

The Super-X buckshot seemed to suffer excessive setback under recoil which hurt pellet penetration. But the Federal 000 buckshot had an average pellet penetration of 10.6 inches. Even the Federal #4 buckshot had an average pellet penetration of 7.1 inches. I have a Taurus Judge with the rail underneath for home defense.

I have a Streamlight on the rail, with the idea being that one hand has light and gun, while other is calling police or manipulating doorknobs, etc. First three shots are PDX rounds and last two are.45 Colt. One of my concerns is over penetration in my modern house. I want to limit collateral threat to family members in other rooms, either from over penetration or from misses. It’s not perfect, but my belief is that a bad guy is not going to wait and see whether the bullets penetrated his lungs or vital organs – they are going to flee as soon a gun is presented or worst case when they start taking hits. It’s by no means a carry gun but it fits my purposes well.

Can you post a picture of your setup? I’m trying to visualize how one could shoot,and manipulate the light one handed while conversing with the 911 dispatcher. There are some great projectile options available for those concerned about over penetration, a valid concern no doubt, however your better off with a dominant 2 handed grip on your weapon, and the judicious application of marksmanship. In my experience a Judge/Governor will produce a HUGE spread of PDX-1 self defence loads at ranges beyond 5 yards. Check out Surefire, or Streamlight’s offerings for grip switches that allow you to activate the light with the middle finger on your shooting grip. Here are the elements you’re criticizing: Title: “Why You Shouldn’t Use.410 Shotshells for Defense” Image: A variety of.410 shotshells Closing statement: “There are better choices for personal defense.” How does all that boil down to “.410s/Judges suck”? If you came into the article, after having read the title, with a vein throbbing in your neck because just, oh man, how COULD he possibly say anything negative about the Judge!?

Then maybe, but those three things even taken together don’t say or even imply that the.410 sucks. They say that you shouldn’t use it for defense, and that there are much better choices.

I can’t really say anything to your impressions, man. Even in retrospect, I felt I was very clear. The wounding properties of the best.410 000 buck ammunition resemble a handful of shots from a small-caliber FMJ-firing handgun (a la a.32 ACP). If I went back, and could identify a flaw with my writing that would give an impression I didn’t want, or make a statement I didn’t intend, that would be one thing, but re-reading the article I still think it’s very clear what I said. “.410 birdshot is bad,.410 “pumpkin balls” make me skeptical, and.410 000 buck is adequate I guess but not winning any awards.” Simple as that, and I don’t see how I muddied the waters there.

How about you take a moment to actually read my “content train wreck”, hm? If you had, instead of getting hung up on the title image, you’d have found I said this: “There are loads designed to improve the Judge’s effectiveness beyond what the light birdshot loads are capable of. Federal also offers a four-ball 000 buck load which should have substantially better effectiveness which I would guess approximates, very roughly, four light.32 ACP FMJ training loads in terminal effect; not a comforting idea, but the load is probably actually lethal as opposed to the substantially sublethal birdshot option.

Winchester has taken the concept a step further, offering its Supreme Elite PDX1 “hockey puck” or “pumpkin ball” load, which is three 68 grain 0.330″ caliber discs backed by twelve 8.5 grain 0.170″ cal BB pellets. The pellets, although somewhat bigger and heavier than #4 shot, probably aren’t contributing much to the lethality of that load, leaving it in the hands of the UFO-shaped discs – a dubious recipe for stopping power.” So, how does the PDX1 perform in gel? Well, here’s an example: 4-8″ of penetration? “Dubious”, indeed. The Hornady triple defense.410 load looks very appealing.

Firing a pattern of controlled dispersion projectiles certainly would assist hitting the vital anatomy of a threat in a self-defense scenario. In addition, I’ve always been dubious of the machine-gun theory of self-defense using a high capacity 9mm handgun. Sure, riddling a torso with 15 rounds of 9mm JHP is very deadly, but such tactics might look awfully suspicious to the legal authorities in the aftermath. Only cops normally get away with that kind of shooting. Many, many moons ago, I wrote up the potential for using pellets larger than 000 Buck in the.410 shotshell.

At the time, I was thinking along the lines of Ballistic Products’ “0000 Buck” (a 0.380″ pellet) and cast round balls in the 0.395″-0.410″ range. In the years that followed, I see that a couple of companies have independently run with the idea. For instance, Nobel Sport Italia offers.410 shells with multiple 0.400″ balls: three pellets in 2.5″ hulls and four pellets in 3″ hulls. At the time, I was inspired by the Saiga-410K-01 and the prototype Franchi bullpup.410. But you realize that.410 =/= 12 gauge, right? And as I said, if you are looking for a self defense round, you are better off by far using a.45 Colt round versus a.410 slug/buckshot/birdshot combo out of your Judge.

In fact, you are better off not buying a Judge period and just getting a proper K-frame or N-frame revolver chambered in.357,.41 or.44 Magnum or 45 Colt and just buying a couple boxes of specialty pelleted ammo for the odd times when you’re out hiking and are worried about snakes. Yeah, I own a Circuit Judge, and the accuracy is crappy relatively compared to a bolt or lever gun, but it’s still good enough for deer or hogs at 50 yards (though I wouldn’t trust it a lot past that). The judge is not a target pistol, but you’re going to be able to put a.45 Colt round in a pie plate with a 3″ judge up to 15-20 yards or so, easy. At that range the 00 buck has spun out well beyond a pie plate and you’re going to be crossing your fingers that one of your 3-4 54 gr. Round musket balls with a bullet weight less than a typical.32 ACP (70 gr.), manages to hit the target somewhere. If you wouldn’t choose a 250 gr. JHP for a judge, you’re really not being sensible.

If the.45 Colt out of a Judge is too inaccurate to trust, then that’s simply yet another argument that virtually any handgun on the market in a decent self-defense caliber will serve you better than a Judge (or Governor). If you want a.45 revolver, any other.45 revolver is better. >but tissue disruption is not great What more do you want? It causes about half the damage of a normal 12 gauge 2 3/4″ 00 buckshot shell from a full size shotgun. If you’re talking about cracks that appear in ballistics gel, those simply don’t exist when shooting actual muscle.

If you want evidence of this look at Fackler’s tests of 5.45x39mm. There’s a picture of a lung that the bullet went through at full tumble and they measured the size of the hole and it’s almost exactly the size of the bullet (their measurements don’t go to the same precision that one would measure the dimensions a bullet at), only when they line up a shot to the liver is there considerable damage left by the temporary cavity. With all due respect to Nathaniel’s research, I don’t think “is the.410 a good choice for self-defense” is really the most interesting question here. I’m more interested in: 1) Given that.410 is not ideal, what is the optimal defensive load in the event that we’re forced into using it anyway? (The article does take an oblique stab at this, and 000 buck certainly seems like a reasonable answer as it often is to questions about defensive shotgun loads.) 2) Assuming we’re using that optimal load, what defensive firearms should we then prefer the.410-loaded Judge (and its ilk) to? Given the comparison to light.32 ACP loads, are we better off with a Judge if the alternative is a Kel-Tec P-32 or a Beretta Tomcat?

3) Taking into account the size, weight, price, recoil, and general complexity of the Judge, what are the most effective comparable alternatives that could be recommended to someone considering a Judge? I’m not sure that the.410 is “ideal”, but we would consider, for example, a.45 ACP as a competent defensive weapon, and it fires a 230 grain projectile at 8-900 f/s; an 11/16 oz charge of shot from a.410 is 300 grains fired at somewhat higher velocity, from a heavier and less-recoiling gun, with the versatility of slugs, BB, birdshot, buck, or centerfire pistol. I’m not sure how that is malignable as a defensive weapon. Lost Season 3 Episode 10 Torrent. I’m not a Judge booster, but I’m just trying to figure out an objective answer here. I don’t agree, however, that the only measure of “effectiveness” is “lethality.” I have often wondered why no one seems to question the merit of the FBI test when evaluating in-home defensive loads.

I think it grossly overstates the value of penetration. The objective, in the case of a close quarters assailant, is incapacitation – which can be accomplished by means other than killing the person. In fact, you could make the case that killing (lethality) is the OPPOSITE of what you want – unless you like picking up bars of soap in the shower for Bubba.

Very often, the muzzle blast is enough to unnerve an attacker. Very often, being hit by a.22 will scare the bejeezus out of an attacker and make him turn tail.

And very often, it is pain that incapacitates, rather than internal organ destruction. Vag-tacho 2.2 Software. A 4″ diameter wound area in a person’s stomach – which is very sensitive to pain – has an immediate “stop and reconsider your profession” effect; the assailant is not calculating penetration depth, sectional density, or anything else other than how to get the hell out of this situation NOW. The birdshot, even, has gone through 4 layers of denim and is now 3 1/2 inches into someone’s abdomen over an area of a 4 or 5 inch diameter circle. That hurts, big time, and the second shot is coming. You aren’t shooting at 25 yards through a car door – the gun is in your kitchen, and so are you. Firing at the head is likewise gonna spin the guy, even if it’s only flesh wounds that do not penetrate the skull – assuming he’s not blind after the first shot. Psychology is a major component of incapacitation.

Furthermore, the instantaneous energy transfer when a load of birdshot transfers all its kinetic energy in a 3 1/2″ penetration path, compared to doing the same over 16 to 18 inches, happens in 1/5th the time; that means the instantaneous hydrostatic shock peak is higher for a given impact velocity. And that shock is delivered over a 13 times larger total surface area of 1 1/4 square inches (11/16 oz*140 pellets/oz.)=96*(.13/2)^2*pi – MUCH higher than the.1 square inch (.355/2)^2*pi cross-sectional area of a 9mm, for example. I just don’t think the question is that one-dimensional. And you can always intersperse.45 Colt and buckshot to provide more contingency characteristics. Don’t get me wrong – I don’t use a Judge, but rather a.40 S&W 4006 – but I think the analysis needs to take more into account than gelatin block penetration when you talk incapacitation, rather than lethality. There’s a certain amount of truth to that – when you are confronted by someone using PCP. The overwhelming majority of the time, however, you will be dealing with a common criminal, who will most likely respond as I have suggested.

There really isn’t any handgun –.454 Casull included – that can be reliably depended upon to stop such a person in his tracks. That’s the work of a 12 gauge. The problem is that losing blood takes time, and handguns don’t damage a body – short of a CNS hit – enough to stop a person in his tracks. Most conflicts happen at close quarters – especially since you must first become aware of the attacker, assess the situation while the attacker approaches, decide that deadly force is required, draw and prepare to fire, announce a warning, and then shoot if necessary. During that time, your assailant is getting closer and closer, so if he’s on PCP and heading towards you, you’re gonna need a bigger gun... A handgun is a weapon you use to defend yourself while getting to your shotgun. For the majority of people other than the insanely possessed, pain will do the trick nicely, allowing you to get away.

I would caution you against concluding that killing someone is the ideal way to stop a conflict – as you would find out when arrested and facing a murder rap. DAs can be bastards – especially when they are gun control freaks. You are better off in court testifying that the ammunition you chose was intentionally designed to incapacitate long enough for you to get away than having the DA tell the jury you chose “killer ammo.”.